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Catching up- someone I know who does *incredible* 3D art just had this same experience with Book Cover Designer. I was shocked because this artist is amazing and you often can't tell it's 3D. I had planned on using BookCoverDesigner and studied it last year. When I came back this year, ready to sell some covers, I was disappointed in some of the really bad covers I saw. They were embarrassingly bad. Some were 3D, some were really bad stock composition. I'm working on selling them on my site instead, though I need to do a LOT of work. I just got the final things I needed, so hoping to crank out more soon.
You're right though- stock is stock, whether it comes from photos or 3D. Book covers were originally painted, and you see photos being processed to look like that for covers all the time. The same is true for 3D. As long as it doesn't look 3D, and instead looks like a great cover, I don't think it matters.
Knittingmommy- It's a good start, but I'd get up closer to her. Get as close as you can, even uncomfortably close. Let the character invite the reader into the cover. Play with angles too. I had the same issue on my first Black Kat cover, where I had a full length shot of her. I found it worked much better to get closer.
That's just one of the fonts that came loaded on my HP computer. Its called hasselweller or something like that, I'm on a different computer right now so I cant check unfortunately. I mentioned the selfpubbook font package because different fonts trigger different visual ideas for placement and layout. You might even come up with something better. There's a few dark underworldly ones in that package worth having a look at, but as I said, I just wanted to suggest that strong white gives a good contrast against a dark background. Both examples used the same font. I like the solid white one too.
If you go to the site, there's an "Artist start here" link, big green letters, it downloads a template package and the fonts are included in there.
@FirstBastion Ah, if it's in the template package then I have it already. I just haven't looked at it in a while. I'll track it down and take a look. I've been looking on some sites for similar fonts to the one you used. I think I'm getting close to something I like that will work similarly to what you have. I don't know if I'll go with that, but I'm definitely going to play with it and see what I can do. And, yes, I realize they are just suggestions to springboard ideas. But, they are darn good suggestions. :)
@Llynara Thanks. I almost hate to render this again, but I'll try a close in upper body shot. This one took two days to render and I like the long line it creates with the text on the side. However, I was planning on playing with different camera angles and close shots so I supposed I should still do that even if I still end up using this one. I'll try some new angles at a lower quality and see how they look.
That's the best way- do them in low quality, save as different files if needed so your original isn't overwritten. I think I had 8 versions of my original Black Kat cover and did at least 50 renders till I finally got it right. The first one was the hardest. Since then, I've been able to cut that in half or more, but I still probably do 20 renders for each cover. I'm still learning and need to do a whole lot more. Hoping some day to knock it down to 5 or 10 but I tend to get a bit OCD about it, LOL
I agree with Llinara, we learn the most through experimentations. Trying out possibilities. 5-10 versions of the art, 5-10 versions of the typography. 20 options to choose from. Guaranteed a cover you'll be happy with, and a cover that will garner attention, will be in there.
What I'd change: I like the font - it definitely suits the feel of the art. But it could probably be made to work better: I second the suggestion about bolding the font - I'd also adjust the line spacing (they're too close), and the type is too close to edges of image in both, but especially the top. I wouldn't go smaller with the title font, so if you can't expand the border around the image I'd resize the figure if she's a separate element from the background. Otherwise, if they're one image that's been rendered and postworked, I'd re-render with a larger buffer zone then repeat the postwork. It looks a bit like you tried to fit the type elements around the image after creating it. It's generally best to compose the image and type elements at the same time, or start with the type elements then compose image. I'd also make the bright spot by her hand less luminous.
What I like: The cover illustration itself is quite pretty, and the postwork has a nice organic feel to it. The girl doesn't look stiff either, she seems pretty natural. The image has a classic children's fantasy feel to it.
Overall: This cover is good enough that, as a reader, were I shopping for a book in that genre, I'd give it a closer look. Aside from the type elements definitely needing some breathing room, nothing suggests "author was too cheap to pay a real artist."
That's my personal criteria for indy books that aren't free e-books. If a writer doesn't value their work enough to pay a decent artist for the cover or recognize when their own artistic skills are lacking, I know I can't expect the book to be good either. If a bad art is good enough for their book, it's only fair to assume bad writing is good enough. This cover definitely shows effort though- you clearly tried with the layout and mostly succeeded.
@knittingmommy I really struggle with typography too so I feal your pain. :) One of the things I have been using to help me is I will pull up layouts similar to what I want to do and see how the people that make the big bucks do it. I look at things like how much bigger is the main title compared the the series title, how many different fonts were used, if accent colors were used on parts of the title, how to divide up the different parts of text that need to go on the book. I'm compleat ignoring the photo and just looking at the typography layout.
@FirstBastion you need to give us all typography lessons, you rock! I thought because I used to design Christmas cards and graduation cards for my photography clients that the book cover thing would be easy. It's NOTHING like designing photo cards!
@Llynara what's that comedy saying "ugly friends make you look better" that's my take on the "bad" work at Thebookcoverdesigner lol However there is also work there that is WAY better then mine! So then mine makes theirs look better. :)
My own bit of news: I sold my 1st cover with a full 3D human on it last night and today the author asked to commission me to do book two also "so it is the same woman" on the cover. Go 3D!
Good thing I saved the scene files because I don't remember who she is. lol
Also I already spent the money I got here at daz, the kids still aren't getting presents. :D
Congratulations!
Yep, been trying to do that. It's still not easy. Hopefully, it will get easier with each cover.
I agree. @FirstBastion needs to give lessons! I think he'd be great at it. :)
Congratulations! Yay, on the commissions, too. Yeah, not something you can do with stock unless you have access to the model.
Lol! I'm sure they'll muddle through. ;)
Congrats @deathbycanon that's very good news indeed :)
Thanks everyone! Speaking of 3D ladies on book covers, I came across this familiar image on amazon today. She is 3D right??? lol
Her 1st book for this series too. The face looks so real! Doesn't it? Or is it just my over exposed to 3D so it doesn't bother me eyes? lol
I can't find any artist credit, the copyrights not included in the preview. Anyone know who did these, they are beautiful.
Those are both stunning covers. They are both very nicely lit shots as well. Artists should make it a requirement of sale, that they insist on credit as part of the sale both inside the book itself and on the store page. Because book cover convince a reader to click through, and in a sea of tiny thumbs, that's a hugely valuable marketing component. The epic fantasy genre has some magnificent art though, so to compete its really need to up the game with great looking art. I clicked through to the page, look how small the thumbnails are for the books,
I'm huge on copyright credit on published work. I can't tell you how many jobs & calls from agents I got because someone got my name off the back of the pet calender they saw my photos in. That credit line is your word of mouth in this business. Maintaining your copyright is also a must! I turned down working for Mead notebooks, to the disappointment of my kids lol, because they wanted to own the copyright of my photos, and their pay is lousy. lol I haven't photographed pets since 2011, and I still am selling those photo to my original publishers, they just keep buying the same photos! lol I make it very clear that I am only selling book cover rights of my artwork, this leaves me open to sell the same artwork again for something else. The artist who did the glitter promo for Divinity also sold a book cover of the same render to Terry Madden as a book cover, because they maintained their copyright.
Totally agree, holding on to your IP is like an investment in your future. Never underestimate its value.
I recently picked up the public domain works of Robert E Howard but while they appear nicely error free (Delphi Classics seem to do a fair job of error checking) the presentation is a bit dull. I decided to spend a little time re-formatting them and typesetting as I quite fancy haveing some physical copies of these via a print on demand service. I'm not fond of doorstops with broken spines, so I'm going to split the works into four volumes. This is the first go at a cover - I think I'm OK with it (I don't want to spend too long on them as I may do covers for other characters in the Howard collection) though I can see I need to adjust the kearning on a couple of letters. Obviously, the image owes more to the comic book version of the character than the original stories but I guess that's just what I grew up with.
That is friggin awesome, DBC! Congrats!
Thank you so much for all the feedback on the Bramble-Child cover. I got sucked into some contract work and had to focus on that for a while but I'm almost done and I'll be back to finishing BC. I ended up with a dilemma because the tool I was using to make the cover doesn't allow me to bold stuff, and I couldn't find the font (which I really feel fits the story) outside of the tool (Adobe Spark). But I did end up rearranging the text so it isn't as closed in, and tweaking the colors some. It's on Amazon now as a pre-order, but I can of course further adjust it as I finish assembling the final form of the book.
Ambitious project. Love the background. Well done, looks very authentic!
Been keeping an eye on new releases from BookCoverDesigner for the last few weeks and today's new covers, and there appears to be a bunch of them, are particularly nice. Again just an observation.
I'm looking for some hidden agenda, are they your covers? lol
I do think most the work there is nice, even if I don't always like it, it just means it's not my particular tastes, but it doesn't mean it's bad art.
Also if anyone is interested, here is a 3D cover design that was denied and a redo that was accepted. And also my ways of dealing with square or horizontal artwork because I don't always work in book cover size format. :)
Rejected Accepted
The first ones are done by Majorgaine, a very talented artist who sells his/her art as stock images on DepositPhotos: https://depositphotos.com/portfolio-1210943.html
The outfit is Powerage's Rebirth of Spring (probably the V4 version, as that's an older image.) You can see Majorgaine's Rendo gallery here: https://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/artist/Majorgaine
Incredible talent! Most of the images are in Poser- some are like Poser 5 or something.
Nothin really hidden, just doing market research. The various covers have a lot of variety, whether we like them or not doesn't really matter. The cover just needs to appeal to one author. Trigger in them the need to buy. it's an interesting market dynamic at play. Some of these providers are churning out 5-8 a week. and the prices run the gamut. it's a fascinating niche market.
I did see the Foundling last week, I particularly liked the dirty hands, exactly what one would expect a 12 year old, who's been playing outside, would have. Little details like that matter. Its a great idea for a story.
Thanks for the link @llynara their work is beautiful!
Ah, market research. I thought you were being cheeky and had just uploaded a bunch of your own covers. :)
I think market research is hugely valuable. case in point two covers that use the same stock photo. The more expensive one sells a couple days after release, while the less expensive one is still available. The one that sold is clearly more artistic and more thematically focused. Everything from the layout, the font used and the size of the subject plays into a better item. It's not ground breaking revelations, but it is stuff worth thiking about.
Great observations. I have been doing a lot of research too, researching instead of designing. :) I have been reading a lot of these articles: https://www.coverdesignstudio.com/book-covers-focal-points/ I can't find where they start or an indexed list of them, but here is where I started. :D Lots of interesting details like what you bring up. How to get your thumbnails to work for you. Font placement. Things I don't think about - like don't use white backgrounds on your books because when they are listed on a place like amazon, that has a white background you loose your edges, so use a pale gray instead. I had just finished a book cover that had a white bottom, but had not submitted it yet, now I'm glad I didn't!
Thanks for the links. That researching will make all future designing more focused. It's like laying a foundation to better building. And that leads to confidence in one's decisions when it comes to designing. You're already creating cool covers, can't wait to see what comes next.
I sold another cover at SelfPubBookCovers the other day. It was just a simple design, as most of those I manage to sell are, and more or less just featured the top of a sword. Looking at those shown on Facebook as some of the others that sold the same day, it turned out to be one of three which also showed not much more than the top of a sword. Someone had obviously been buying for a series, and if I'd complicated the design by adding much more (maybe a hand with an ornate ring or something) the cover would probably not have been what they were looking for. 'Simple' seems to sell.
Another thing I've noticed is that covers without people or faces seem to do better when selling to authors, probably because the author will already have 'painted' their character with words and the chances of them finding a cover which illustrates it are a lot slimmer. I think all authors like to give readers a bit of room to use their imagination too, which is why some people will watch the film of a book and say 'She was just like I imagined!' and others will watch the same film and come away disappointed. SelfPubBookCovers shows you which of your covers authors have saved with a possible view to buying one day, and very few of my most saved feature people or recognisable faces. I don't do this full time and can go for months without submitting anything and other people's experiences will vary, but of the eighteen covers I've actually sold, just two feature people shown full-length from the front, one of which shows a person sitting so far away that you can barely see her face. A third cover shows the torso of a teenager holding a cellphone, and another shows a blonde walking to the beach from behind - both of these people could be almost anyone. Two more show silhouettes and the other twelve don't show people at all.
I'm not saying covers with faces don't sell - they do - but they do seem to be in the minority. I suppose that if Agatha Christie and PD James had been looking to SelfPubBookCovers in their early days they might both have been attracted to a cover showing nothing more than the hand of a corpse resting in a pool of blood, but if it had also featured a detective that looked like Adam Dalgliesh there would have been no chance of Christie choosing it, and if the detective had looked like Miss Marples instead then James would have written it off without a second glance. If the cover had depicted a Sherlock Holmes type with a pipe and deerstalker then it would have been useless to both of them. A simple element from a genre or theme, portrayed in a striking way will likely have a much broader appeal to authors than an attempt to illustrate an entire event from a story or the people who might be involved in it.
I hope some of that helps someone. I've learned a lot myself from this discussion.
Astracadia you make an excellent observation. The idea is universal appeal. With less specifics, more potential viewers can find elements in the image that appeals to them. Thus you increase your potential buyers pool, improving the chances of selling. I did see those three sword covers, and they had an almost graphic arts quality to them, making them even more flexible. They could work in a young reader or children's book too. All 3 had bright vibrant colors as well. Very helpful info, thanks!
If you look at the best sellers on Amazon, depending on genre, there are quite a few with heads cut off, only parts of the body and sometimes no people at all. Just depends. Whatever works- seems like there are many ways to approach it.