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Once again, thank you Dollygirl! I re-positioned the two main actors to be closer to the Rule of 3rds. After some thought of what to add to the bottom 3rd of the scene to give it more balance, I added the fleeing girl in the bottom right (our view). DOF helps to make her visible but blur her enough so that she becomes less of a possible distraction. Let me know your thoughts!
I am seriously confused, as always when being flogged by various iterations of this "rule". Are you suggesting that every "sweet spot" have an item of interest?
Thanks for suggesting the 3rd figure
It's more of a visual rule. Eyes tend to wander if there is limited or improper focus, or sometimes reject the image altogether. It's something I am working on more as well. :)
You can see the rule even being used in movies. The rule of the 3rd's isn't the only rule, but for us beginners, it's on of the easiest to learn to start. If you search back in this thread, I think it was Scott that posted a link to a video that helped me tremendously!
The rules are just a small part of making the image the best possible! :D
To add, not every sweet spot needs to have an item. The Focal Item, Character, Part of the scene, etc needs to be in one of those 4 spots, if following the Rule of 3rds. Balance, like in my photo above is also important. Place your photo on an imaginary scale. You want to avoid dramatic weight to right and left and top and bottom, as if a scale was balanced as much as possible. That video I described above does a better justice of explanation than me, though.
Your welcome poetman75. You have made a noticeable set of improvements. I like what you did. You brought balance and you added to the story. I think that I would play around with color of the two main characters to see if you can get the eye of the viewer pulled into the image.
No I am not suggesting that there be something at each sweet spot. So sorry if I have confused you. I think poetman75 summed up what is intended very well and I thank him/her for stepping up and answering the question. Always does one's heart good when what is trying to be pointed out is repeated in such a succinct manner.
I think the video that poetman75 is referring to is this one.
Your welcome Teofa. Yes, I agree, that third figure did the trick. There is no size limits except those imposed by the forum itself, which says that an attachment can not be larger than 9999KB. Is there anything else you would like to do to your image?
Thank you Dollygirl.
If anyone is looking for a bit of inspiration, I came across this post a while ago and added it to my bookmarks.
http://izismile.com/2014/11/18/great_cinematographic_shots_from_film_and_tv_34_pics.html
Your welcome poetman75. You have made a noticeable set of improvements. I like what you did. You brought balance and you added to the story. I think that I would play around with color of the two main characters to see if you can get the eye of the viewer pulled into the image.
Thank you again! When you say play with the color of the character do you mean lighting colors or texture colors? :)
Oh and I am a he. :)
No I am not suggesting that there be something at each sweet spot. So sorry if I have confused you. I think poetman75 summed up what is intended very well and I thank him/her for stepping up and answering the question. Always does one's heart good when what is trying to be pointed out is repeated in such a succinct manner.
I think the video that poetman75 is referring to is this one.
Your welcome Teofa. Yes, I agree, that third figure did the trick. There is no size limits except those imposed by the forum itself, which says that an attachment can not be larger than 9999KB. Is there anything else you would like to do to your image?
Thanks for the clarification. I'm not unfamiliar with the subject. Anyone remotely involved in imagery is painfully aware of it.
This is nearly my final. I really like the added figure, thank you. I have to post process some small things I'd rather not build new textures for.
Renamed it "HALT'.
ok played a bit more with ositions and framing, learned a bit with depth of field..
I'm fighting the urge to go for spectacle over simplicity, though..
Thank you again! When you say play with the color of the character do you mean lighting colors or texture colors? :)
Oh and I am a he. :)
Try texture colors first, they would be easier. If you remember in the video the men in the red pants all the way in the background?
You are most welcome. Oh good will call you him.
Thanks for the clarification. I'm not unfamiliar with the subject. Anyone remotely involved in imagery is painfully aware of it.
This is nearly my final. I really like the added figure, thank you. I have to post process some small things I'd rather not build new textures for.
Renamed it "HALT'.
Good luck then.
What makes you think you have not achieved it with this image? I see this as something of a great poster. Lots of color, action and a very beautiful babe.
What makes you think you have not achieved it with this image? I see this as something of a great poster. Lots of color, action and a very beautiful babe.
If you head to my dA page and look at the big version of my holiday entry from last month, there's just stuff and more stuff...bits and piece everywhere , books you don't quite see, lists of names on the computer (like yours :) ), specifically designed plans and things that no one would notice if not pointed out...That tends to be my artistic style...lots of bits and bobs.
This is really just the singer and the dancer, just blinding light coming in from the stadium door...It's a very paired down approach for me.
(I've thought of having like concert security on either side of the door, or band or dancers off to the side...you can see in the picture below from setting up the DOF that there's a bunch of details on the singer's outfit I put in that are unseen...)
It's just finding the discipline to show the scene with simplicity, rather than to try to dazzle with spectacle.
Here is improved version of my wizard picture. I hope i will be able to work on it a bit more before posting. Light is i guess done, i would like to morph that sleeves just to look a bit more natural, but i will have to check about that tutorial about morph saving. Anyway here it goes, maybe a bit darker this time.
Btw can we enter pictures with size more then 800 pixels, i have seen that there is no line about size in the rules now?
You are most welcome Linwelly.
Linwelly, you have improved your image. I think that there are a couple of items that Cris mentioned that might make you like your image even more. If you look real close at her demonstration image you will notice that she moved the guy-with-the-knife's body. She also said to do a stronger silhouette of the dragon. To do the silhouette you can add a spot light above and behind the dragon. This would represent the lighting from the moon and give you a nice ring of light around the wings and maybe his legs.
Ok, I guess I have reached the end of my ideas. There hast been a spotlight behind the dragon from the start and at 200% if not at pure white.
Would a second light make a difference? Or do I need to give the dragon a different surface (more glossyness or higher reflection?) I admit I would hate to change his colour as i really like it. :long:
For the guy I can tweak him a little more to get into that aggressive stance, but Cris cut out a peace of the mountainside (how did she even do that?). That certainly helps the general impression and give the guy more wight but I am lost here how to do that without setting the whole scene up from the start.
Changing the angle of the camery wouldn't help, I tried that (beside screwing up the rest of the scene)
I hope this will turn out good before the end of the contest :)
Ok, I guess I have reached the end of my ideas. There hast been a spotlight behind the dragon from the start and at 200% if not at pure white.
Would a second light make a difference? Or do I need to give the dragon a different surface (more glossyness or higher reflection?) I admit I would hate to change his colour as i really like it. :long:
For the guy I can tweak him a little more to get into that aggressive stance, but Cris cut out a peace of the mountainside (how did she even do that?). That certainly helps the general impression and give the guy more wight but I am lost here how to do that without setting the whole scene up from the start.
Changing the angle of the camery wouldn't help, I tried that (beside screwing up the rest of the scene)
I hope this will turn out good before the end of the contest :)
I really like the changes you've made...this is shaping up nicely!
Since you already have a spotlight behind the dragon, you could either add a second (edited to add: for instance, you could have one spotlight coming from the upper left, and one from the upper right), or experiment with adjusting the angle and position of your existing light.
The other lighting change I'd suggest is taking the light that's hitting the female character from the front, and making the color a little darker (I might go with yellowish, but you could try blue or gray or another shade instead). The bright white light reminds me of an incandescent lamp like headlights or a powerful flashlight, which gives the lighting a more modern/contemporary feeling than the other elements in the scene. At least to me.
If you want to play with the dragon's surface settings, I might try using Velvet (this might require you to change your dragon's skin surfaces to another shader, such as UberSurface or the Age of Armour Subsurface Shader; instructions can be found here). Not sure a velvety dragon is what you want (sounds kind of odd, doesn't it?), but it might help to catch the light, especially around the edges.
If you head to my dA page and look at the big version of my holiday entry from last month, there's just stuff and more stuff...bits and piece everywhere , books you don't quite see, lists of names on the computer (like yours :) ), specifically designed plans and things that no one would notice if not pointed out...That tends to be my artistic style...lots of bits and bobs.
This is really just the singer and the dancer, just blinding light coming in from the stadium door...It's a very paired down approach for me.
(I've thought of having like concert security on either side of the door, or band or dancers off to the side...you can see in the picture below from setting up the DOF that there's a bunch of details on the singer's outfit I put in that are unseen...)
It's just finding the discipline to show the scene with simplicity, rather than to try to dazzle with spectacle.
You're allowed two entries, and there is no rule preventing you from entering two different versions of the same scene. So you could potentially go for spectacle with your second one. :coolsmirk:
The downside, of course, is that your two entries would basically be competing against each other, as well as the other contestants' entries.
At any rate, my only advice at this point is to keep working on it until you're satisfied with it, or at least until you're satisfied that you've done everything that you could within the allotted time.
My personal thoughts on the present scene is that you do want a pared-down approach, so that all the viewer's attention is directed to the dancer and the singer. But that doesn't necessarily mean that you can't have anything else in the scene. A few additions, as long as they're not distracting, might help to set the scene. But on the other hand, it's not really needed, so do what feels right to you. :)
Nice work, I think this is an improvement over the earlier versions. I like how the dragon's body is kind of surrounding the one fighter and its mouth is pointed at the other...this increases the sense of menace, similar to Linwelly's image with the knife pointed at the dragon. The improved poses also help to build suspense.
To further improve the image I'd think about how the scene is lit (torches? sun/moonlight coming through a window? dragon fire or magical sources?) and adjust the lights' colors, positions, and intensities accordingly. As Dollygirl said, color can help to draw the viewer's attention to the characters, and possibly add more drama and suspense, too.
Very dramatic lighting...I like this much better! I do agree with Cris's earlier advice on your character's pose, but ultimately you have to go with what fits your own vision. :)
Here is another, this one is a bit lighter. And yeah i could go without crystall ball but i like it, I hope some day I will be able to fit something inside of it :). I will try to work on sleeves tomorrow, i need to fit them to look a bit better. This one is larger 1076x1076 looks better.
Thanks again Dollygirl and Scott! All of you guys make this not just a learning experience, but a fun one as well!
Okay, I enhanced the collar, greaves, and some of the textures on the right hand character. I used a combination of blue, grey, or brown diffuse to try to enhance them. I also added a brighter red to the strappings.
On the left character, I did something similar but played with the specular a bit as well. I also added a blue light similar to the moonlight shining on the back right (near the partially visible staircase that is hitting on the back (left) wall. Let me know what you think!
Ok, now I'm like 99% done, I think..have a super render going overnite...
Fine tuned the depth of field to get blurring, but still recognizable in the singer (had fresh eyes look at this, and things like the mic and guitar weren't identifiable), and tweaked the posing a little..fixed some details, like the guitar strap, her necklce..Better titling level on the carpet..
I'd love to get less..wrinkles? distotions? on the dress, but that might be just too much to do (changing morphs in the body didn't help.).
It's a G2F dress already, so it's not an autofit thing...just..a ..how it is, thing maybe.
I agree with Dolly and Scott on the suggestions and I like what you've done with the image. It's got such a wonderfully cohesive palette and such nice lighting. Well done!
You are most welcome Linwelly.
Linwelly, you have improved your image. I think that there are a couple of items that Cris mentioned that might make you like your image even more. If you look real close at her demonstration image you will notice that she moved the guy-with-the-knife's body. She also said to do a stronger silhouette of the dragon. To do the silhouette you can add a spot light above and behind the dragon. This would represent the lighting from the moon and give you a nice ring of light around the wings and maybe his legs.
What Dolly says about the lighting is very true. Getting the lighting to look more realistic for night, actually can mean subduing the saturation a bit...but for an illustration, that can be subjective. On the other hand, the lighting needs to have just the right tinge of a hue that would be found in the setting. You have a night scene, but the lights on the figures are rather white. This is more a modern lighting range of tones than one where the light may be coming from torches or braziers which would have more yellows and oranges, moonlight would have very light blue or yellow depending on the type of moon, and the desaturation would come from the night reducing the light perception. So you can think on that for a while to see what is the lighting in your scene and how are you directiing it (types of lights). Lighting will be covered more in future, but all of these elements play into creating a more staged or more realistic image and finding the balance for your needs.
No I am not suggesting that there be something at each sweet spot. So sorry if I have confused you. I think poetman75 summed up what is intended very well and I thank him/her for stepping up and answering the question. Always does one's heart good when what is trying to be pointed out is repeated in such a succinct manner.
I think the video that poetman75 is referring to is this one.
Your welcome Teofa. Yes, I agree, that third figure did the trick. There is no size limits except those imposed by the forum itself, which says that an attachment can not be larger than 9999KB. Is there anything else you would like to do to your image?
I am agreement with the recommendations made by Dolly.
Sometimes, it's the littlest things that pop out at you. The foreground figure has obviously seen something and she is readying to get out her weapon...perhaps. What you need to do is think keyframe. In animation, we have two types of animators, the lead animators who do the keyframes and the inbetweeners that do the frames between the keyframes. The keyframes are the main actions in an animation, the frames between get you from one keyframe to the next. So you want to always think in keyframes when you are doing your illustrations. What can you do to get your story across in one pivotal moment. What things will drive that action so the viewer gets it the moment they look at your image. Should her hand be flipping open the gun case, should her hand already be pulling the gun out, should her other hand clench to indicate her sudden tension, is she beginning to say something and is it to who/whatever is in front of her, or a warning to her compatriots with a slight cock of the chin down to indicate she's telling them to beware, but not taking her eyes off what perks her attention? What is your story here? As you tell it to me in words, remember, your viewer won't see any of what you describe unless it's already in the image...do you see what I mean?
Who knew you had so much to ponder when you decided to make a nice little image, eh? :)
We are storytellers without words...the scene is the book we are looking into, the body language, the placement of the figures within the scene, the way things are lit, the way we frame the scene, the way we lead our viewer through the image and tell the story. It's what I love most about illustration. My job is just to provide you with ideas and things to think about and hope they serve as a catalyst to help you create the best image you can.
What makes you think you have not achieved it with this image? I see this as something of a great poster. Lots of color, action and a very beautiful babe.
I think you've been doing some very good explorations and the choices for your depth of field are good and interesting. As to the wrinkles on the dress, you said you wanted fewer? Do you find them distracting or something? I don't see anything wrong with what you have on her.
Looks good, Scavenger.
I think the thing I liked more in your previous darker version is the pedestal for the crystal ball was less prominent. In the lighter version, my eye gets drawn right to it because of the contrast.
I very much like the lighting changes...feels much more fire-lit and the coloration on the wizard is nice and cool in contrast. Do watch for the tangent being created by the top of the magic "bubble" and the stoneware behind it.
LOL! Shall I tell you that 1) I mistook the side of the mountain for the chest of your assailant...hah! 2) I simply use lasso and make a copy of what's in the lasso, then on the original image, i remove what's in the lasso with "fill with content aware" in Photoshop (I use CC 2015). I use the color picker to pick up colors if I need to do any fill-ins or additions.
That certainly helps the general impression and give the guy more wight but I am lost here how to do that without setting the whole scene up from the start.
Changing the angle of the camery wouldn't help, I tried that (beside screwing up the rest of the scene)
Since you already have a spotlight behind the dragon, you could either add a second (edited to add: for instance, you could have one spotlight coming from the upper left, and one from the upper right), or experiment with adjusting the angle and position of your existing light.
The other lighting change I'd suggest is taking the light that's hitting the female character from the front, and making the color a little darker (I might go with yellowish, but you could try blue or gray or another shade instead). The bright white light reminds me of an incandescent lamp like headlights or a powerful flashlight, which gives the lighting a more modern/contemporary feeling than the other elements in the scene. At least to me.
If you want to play with the dragon's surface settings, I might try using Velvet (this might require you to change your dragon's skin surfaces to another shader, such as UberSurface or the Age of Armour Subsurface Shader; instructions can be found here). Not sure a velvety dragon is what you want (sounds kind of odd, doesn't it?), but it might help to catch the light, especially around the edges.
Your image is really coming together. :)
Just to give you some food for fodder, I threw a warm orange-yellow filter over your image, used a black/white masking gradient from lower right diagonally up to upper left to let a possible torch cast some warmth and light on the right side of the image. I also used dodge to lighten things closer to the torch.
Learning how to use color and light effectively to bring your attention to certain areas, can change your image...your overall tone was bluish, so i thought it would be interesting to see the effect of an orange complement on one half. Again, only suggestions for you to ponder.