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Oh my yes I like what you did.
Hi Kismet,
Love the composition of this piece. Having the windows on either side of the tree helps to pull your eye to it and then to see such a sweet puppy, sleeping under the tree (with no damage as of yet!). I like that you set the scene with the tree to the side. It adds interest to your piece.
I think if I were working on this image that I would put some pillows and maybe a throw on the sofa. Maybe even a plate of half eaten cookies, although with that puppy over there I don't know. I think I would enlarge the bells just a little bit to help balance out the wreath on the right. I might even leave them alone and add a wreath behind them. I would see if I could find a little shelf that the socks could hang off of. As for the lighting I think I would leave the ambient lighting the way it is but I would play with the uber area light shader to see if I could get some of the light strings to emit light and provide the additional illumination. I thought szark's tutorial was the most helpful and it is here: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/14536/. Finally after I had gotten the lights to work I would play around with Adam's render presets to remove the graininess from the image. You can find Adam's presets here: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/16085/
My comments are just suggestions. Looking forward to seeing your next version.
Thank you Dollygirl. Great suggestions. :)
@Dollygirl
Thanks for your comment and for your help !
Your most welcome Kismet and adbc!
I edited this today, and figured out that my problem with the shaders disappearing had something to do with putting Genesis one in the scene with Genesis 2. Not sure why but when I removed genesis 1 I stopped having the problem of disappearing shaders. This is my latest render. I have been having problems with lighting as far as the column on the right goes, if I reduce the intensity the whole scene looks to dark and when I bring it up in intensity it creates the over exposed look on the column. I am thinking of trying to fix that in post work, but am concerned it will stand out.
Hi gwydyons,
A scary Christmas indeed. Lots of characters all of them interesting and there is good interaction between the small groups. I like the idea that they are all standing in water. I like the colors of your render as well.
If I were working on this scene I would bump up the tiling on the walls, columns and tomb surfaces. I think that would make the pattern calm down and allow my eyes to rest. I am not seeing the characters with that strong of pattern on the temple surfaces. I really like the water but I would add some ripples to it. I know characters do not usually hold still so there should be little waves around their ankles. There are a couple of ways to make ripples. The first way is to create a bump map that DAZ can use to give us our ripples. I found the three following tutorials to be most helpful. First one, http://www.evermotion.org/tutorials_old/particles/rain/ showed me a ripple pattern that I really liked. The image is almost down at the bottom of the page and is called ripple bump map. The second tutorial showed me how to use a bump map in DAZ Studio http://darkhound1.deviantart.com/art/Daz-Studio-4-5-small-tutorial-about-bump-mapping-348278445. And this third tutorial is my old standby and explains to me just how displacement and bump work. http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/artzone/pub/tutorials/textures/misc-text56. It is unfortunate that the images do don't show but there is information that can help make what DAZ Studio is doing when a bump map in put in the bump channel.
The second way to create ripples is by deforms and I used this tutorial to help me to create morphs on a plane to create the ripples. http://www.sharecg.com/v/71562/browse/3/PDF-Tutorial/Creating-ripples-in-Daz-Studio The last thing I would do is fix the lady in the center back. She is not flying nor is she standing so I would play with her feet until I got the look of flying or standing.
AS I keep telling everyone, these are suggestions. Only ideas to play with if you want. Looking forward to seeing what you decide to do.
Here's a second draft - I tried to show a bit more of the emotion as suggested, and framed more around the people than the background...still not happy with the lighting and haven't figured out how to 'grime' the characters up more. Dollygirl is right: they look like they just stepped out of the shower to put their rags on. Any advice/comments/kind-hearted-humorous-remarks welcomed.
Hi gwydyons,
A scary Christmas indeed. Lots of characters all of them interesting and there is good interaction between the small groups. I like the idea that they are all standing in water. I like the colors of your render as well.
If I were working on this scene I would bump up the tiling on the walls, columns and tomb surfaces. I think that would make the pattern calm down and allow my eyes to rest. I am not seeing the characters with that strong of pattern on the temple surfaces. I really like the water but I would add some ripples to it. I know characters do not usually hold still so there should be little waves around their ankles. There are a couple of ways to make ripples. The first way is to create a bump map that DAZ can use to give us our ripples. I found the three following tutorials to be most helpful. First one, http://www.evermotion.org/tutorials_old/particles/rain/ showed me a ripple pattern that I really liked. The image is almost down at the bottom of the page and is called ripple bump map. The second tutorial showed me how to use a bump map in DAZ Studio http://darkhound1.deviantart.com/art/Daz-Studio-4-5-small-tutorial-about-bump-mapping-348278445. And this third tutorial is my old standby and explains to me just how displacement and bump work. http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/artzone/pub/tutorials/textures/misc-text56. It is unfortunate that the images do don't show but there is information that can help make what DAZ Studio is doing when a bump map in put in the bump channel.
The second way to create ripples is by deforms and I used this tutorial to help me to create morphs on a plane to create the ripples. http://www.sharecg.com/v/71562/browse/3/PDF-Tutorial/Creating-ripples-in-Daz-Studio The last thing I would do is fix the lady in the center back. She is not flying nor is she standing so I would play with her feet until I got the look of flying or standing.
AS I keep telling everyone, these are suggestions. Only ideas to play with if you want. Looking forward to seeing what you decide to do.
Thank you I appreciate all the great advice. Though thats fog on the floor :-) lol. I am checking out the tutorials you suggested too. :-)
Yes much better on the interactions and moving the focus to your central characters. What do you not like about your lighting? What is it that you want to do? Right now you have a bright sunny day type lighting which is good.
As for how to grunge up your characters. There are three ways you can go:
Buy your grunge http://www.daz3d.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=grunge
Use the Layered Image Editor http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/artzone/pub/software/lie/reference/lie_using To access the editor you will need to go to the surface tab, select the surface you want to add grunge to, go to the Diffuse parameter, click on the down arrow in the image box, at the top about the fourth item down there will be Layered Image Editor... Click on this and it will open up a window. The link above explains how to use it.
Pull your textures into a graphics program and layer some grunge brush strokes. Save this out as a new texture and apply in the Diffuse Color. Here are some free brushes for Photoshop and I think gimp can read them as well: http://dotcave.com/freebies/grunge-brushes-for-photoshop/
As for some more suggestions if I were working on this picture I would have the angel guide with his hands. I would also see what kind of vehicle I could come up with to represent the donkey in the scene. A beat up motor bike would be pretty cool. I would also add some more larger trash elements such as rusty barrels, rusted out cars and such. I would also make Joe's hand touch Mary's back.
These are just suggestions. Looking forward to seeing what you do.
Your welcome gwydyons. Sorry about the mix up on the fog. I think why I thought water was because it looks like the fog has the reflective parameter on or that the transparency is set to low. But the idea of ripples would still work. It would give the fog some thin and thick areas which is what fog would do. I would see if I could tone down some of the reflections that are seen on the floor to get a more realistic fog look.
Ok, not sure it's really WIP, as I keep getting the duf file corrupted and having to start over again :-(
I'm learning waaaay more than I expected to on surfaces and did try the layered surface editor, but not sure I knew what I was doing. Also, how surfaces in DAZ translate (or not) to Luxrender (via Reality 4) is beyond me. Seems like I have to manage them twice, and lose some of the control.
Anyhow...I haven't given up [yet]. Will keep plugging away, and as always, constructive input very much welcomed.
Some nice changes. Love the truck, tire and wheel. Pretty sneaky to put a Christmas tree in the scene as well.
Ahh now that we know you are using Reality. To add smudges, you will need to use the third option which is modify the textures of your characters in a graphics program. Reality does not support the other two functions at this time.
When working in Reality/Luxrender you are working under the premise that you want a real world picture of your scene. When you do that, constraints are put on the scene to make it work under this premise. You have 9 surface types and if you identify a surface as glass then you must select the Lux Material of glass. Your selection should be based upon what the object is representing in the real world. DAZ Studio on the other hand has no such constraints. So a toon shader can be applied in DAZ Studio but not in Reality/ Luxrender. Lux does not know about some of the equations that the toon shader tells Studio it wants it to use when it renders that particular surface. Lux only has the equations for real things and how those real things interact in a earth like environment. Almost all of the shaders that we can apply in DAZ Studio are not real. They are approximations or just plain fantasy having never seen the light of day.
It looks like you have been playing around with the lighting. I am assuming by the changes that you wish for more diffuse light. Palo provides a prop to help with that. On page 20 of this document http://preta3d.com/repository/Reality_docs/Reality_Users_Guide_2.0.pdf about 1/3 of the way down the page he talks about lighting, look for the paragraph about the Diffuser. Interesting stuff .
Looking forward to seeing what you do.
What is the lighting that you are using in the scene?
Well, I've made a bunch of progress on my entry for this...It'll be my third holiday themed contest...(chalk it up to having too much time on my hands and hitting a breakthrough point in how my renders turn out.
I'm doing a HQ render overnight to see how the lighting I'm going with looks, textures, and to start spotting trouble spots for fine tuning, but I think I have everything posed and placed how I'm going to go.
Have a few issues with the skirts on the sitting people. It's frustating that they just don't behave right..either they flap up on top, or the bottoms go pushing through the seats..I've just about given up on that in Daz and will fix in photoshop in post, but that feels so......giving up-ish. Any tips?
Something I would like opinions on, I'm debating on rotating the desk/chair section a little towards the camera so the person sitting at the desk's face is a bit more visible... She had been facing the camera more, then I realized she wasn't in anyway looking and pointing at the computer, which is the whole plot of the picture, so I put a camera in the monitor to line her up, but now her face will just be pretty much hidden.
Adam's presets should be handed out to everyone who enters the "Newbie" section of this forum. Getting them really gave me a lot of confidence moving forward, even if I still don't understand what all the settings are. Really eliminated one of the big barriers for getting nice renders, which encourages (me at least) to do more and learn more.
A slight rotation of the desk would bring 2 of your figures more in line with the camera.
I face this dilemma all the time. Just when I think I have a scene set up exactly the way I want it I see something that needs adjusting/tweaking, etc.
Adam's presets are one of those tools I automatically use on every render. Another one is Jaderail's Golden Rules: http://www.sharecg.com/v/67783/gallery/21/DAZ-Studio/Golden-Rules-Camera-Prop-v1.5
There is a Rule of Thirds built into DAZ Studio but I find Jaderial's set has many options and is indispensable in composition. As soon as I load a camera I immediately attach Jaderail's Golden Rules.
Title: Santa Was Here
Program: DAZ Studio 4.7
I wanted a middle of the night feel for this render and was not really satisfied with my prior versions. I replaced the skydome and redid the lighting for a night feel. Added some of DollyGirl's suggestions (thank you for those :-) ) and I am much happier with the results.
Any comments/suggestions are appreciated.
Scavenger,
A lovely composition you have there. Very interesting depiction of Christmas Eve. As for tips on getting meshes to behave. There are not any fix it all kind of tools out there just yet. I would image that DAZ is hearing people say they need more options on the mesh collision analysis so that you could add the chair or desk as another item that constrains where the clothing with go. Until that time here are a few ideas you might want to play around with:
Look for the response to recombinantmicrobe by me. This is about fitting other figure's clothing to the genesis series of figures but the concept of being able to move the bones is applicable to clothing designed for the genesises.
http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/30004/P780/#711175
Another option is to use d-formers. This video is for Studio 3 but the concept and commands remain the same for Studio 4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SEBV2GHJHA
For your second request, to move or not to move, you have graduated into the area of personal preference. I like the current point of view. You have placed me at a desk in the command center and I am taking a minute to watch what is happening around me. I don't need to have eye contact with the subjects because rightfully so they are concentrating on making the night a success. I love the way that you have positioned the viewer. Having a partial view of the desk is a great way to set the scene. Because of the point of view this image is no longer in the realm of portraiture, interest lies in what mini stories can be told, so seeing all of the faces full on is not as important. But, like I said it is personal preference, do what you gotta do.
Looking forward to seeing what you end up with.
your welcome Kismet. I like the extra snow outside.
I think the bit that seems slightly off to me is the brightness of the garland around the tree, It gives the impression that it is a lit garland as it appears to be glowing.
Thanks for the comments..I didn't get an email notfying me of it earlier, so I haven't looked at your suggestions yet :p, but I will and hopefully they'll help me solve the stuff I've been spending a few hours on now.
Basically the skirts...
On the one, from in front, it's just trying to find a balance between where the skirt is shaped so it's not just flying up, but also not just dropping thru the desk, or not even showing up, being eaten by the tights.
Then on the other two, that damn skirt hem crease. And trying to get the curve right.
A bunch of the points I can fix after in Photoshop, but it's almost a matter of pride to try to get it to render right.
Oh deformers.
I tried going thru that video some months ago.
D-Formers are perhaps the worst implemented feature I've seen in this program. It's about manipulating a gird, without the ability to be placed on a grid. I guess it works fine on a flat plane, but a 3d-Dress? I've spent over an hour just trying to get the red section to the point I want to affect.
Is not the square in the screen shot below supposed to be the center of the field? The red is no where near there.
If a programer is perhaps peaking in.. Right Click "Add D Former here"
Adding in the DAZ camera orbit bug that it doesn't stop moving when you release the mouse...
I'm rather frustrated :)
--------------------------------
Also, in the "release the mouse area"....Why do things not stay where you adjust them with sliders. In the Other screen shot (AND SERIOUSLY...ALLOW IN LINE GRAPHICS IN THE FORUM!!! ) On the left is where the hem gets when adjusting a morph, with the mouse clicked...when I release it, it pops up to the right. Morph slider stays the same.
(I'm trying to get a major rant out of this thread where nice people are offereing help to dumb folks like me).
Thanks for the comments..I didn't get an email notfying me of it earlier, so I haven't looked at your suggestions yet :p, but I will and hopefully they'll help me solve the stuff I've been spending a few hours on now.
Basically the skirts...
On the one, from in front, it's just trying to find a balance between where the skirt is shaped so it's not just flying up, but also not just dropping thru the desk, or not even showing up, being eaten by the tights.
Then on the other two, that damn skirt hem crease. And trying to get the curve right.
A bunch of the points I can fix after in Photoshop, but it's almost a matter of pride to try to get it to render right.
I will talk about your first issue in the next response since using deformers would be one way to go. But I will address the second issue here which is the funny creeky thing going on with the skirt. I am assuming that you are using genesis clothing. By this I mean that you are using genesis or genesis 2 and that the clothing on the figures was designed specifically for that figure or that you auto transferred the clothing to genesis. If that is the case then the effect you are seeing is caused by the weight map and how it was painted. I found that these two videos helped me understand what the maps do and how to adjust them to remove some of these unpleasant side affects.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjgIC2vhRII
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIIM1oAan7o
I think that if you go in and smooth out that area you might like the results better. The store also has some products that can help you as well. Sickleyield has some helpers. You can also find further information about weight maps in the various rigging tutorials available in the shop.
Sorry to hear that you are frustrated. I can see your point about being able to just select a poly on the object and apply the deformer. You can do that in Hexagon, Blender, Carrara or any other modeling program and it is a very nice feature but I can also see many good uses for the current design as well.
So to answer your question about what the universal tool is telling you when you see it in your window. When the deformer is initially applied the universal tools for the field, the base and the deformer are dead center to the sphere of influence of the field (those 3 red circles you see in the window). The default sphere size is determined by what polygons you have chosen to modify and it is placed in the center of this set of polygons. If you change the x, y, or z positions of the field the universal tool remains dead center to the sphere. When you move the field and the object becomes located on the outer edges of the sphere then the influence of the field changes as reflected by the spline you have chosen for the field and you see a shift in the color of the dots. So the red circles you see when you select the field establish the outer edges of the sphere. Beyond the red circles nothing will happen when you move the deformer. So when you are getting things set up you should be looking at the red circles and if the area that you are wanting to move is not in that set of circles you won't be able to change anything. If the area is in the circles, then it will change as determined by the spline you have selected. Moving the base allows you to place the deformer in an area where you can easily see it and once you move the base then you are no longer in the center of influence but the deformer ignores the base's location when performing the deformation and the change in the deformer's position is applied to all that is in the red circles.
In your picture your circles are pretty large. I would scale the field's the overall scale setting down and I would squish or flatten the X scale to only have the edge of the skirt you want to change within the circle. Also small is better with dformers. My best successes have been working on one specific area at a time.
For your question about why the mouse and sliders are working funny. I am thinking that you are challenging your mouse to move very tiny amounts and the mouse and Studio are not playing nice. So may be if you change the nudge factor in the parameters you want to change then you might have better success. The default nudge factor in the deformer translation parameters is set up for 1. I find that if I go in and drop that down to 0.1 I have an easier time moving the polys. Doing this allows me to move the mouse a normal amount but the nudge is so small that only a tiny movement is allowed in the window. To do this go to parameters -> Translation -> Y Translate. In the upper right hand corner you will see a grayed out gear, left click on it and select Parameter Settings. A window will open, look for nudge and set the number to 0.1, click on accept. You can do this for any or all of the parameters.
I hope this helps you. Good luck
I think the bit that seems slightly off to me is the brightness of the garland around the tree, It gives the impression that it is a lit garland as it appears to be glowing.
I tend to agree with you Chohole. So I turned down the reflection on the garland.
yes, that does look better
Scene looks good. Should probably add some ambient to a couple of the bulbs and the star. Scene looks very flat with no light. If you make some of the tree glow then that will add the needed light without losing the feel of it being dark in the house.
Thanks for your help Dolly. I'm gonna do some work with D-Formers later to try to get a handle on them.
I decided for this image, we're talking about things that might not even be noticeable at contest size (800 pixels? my master version of the image is 3840 x 2160!!!! :D ) so spending a lot of time and blood preasure points on them just isn't worth it. So I moved on for some final prop arrangements, some pose tweaks, several program crashes right before or during file saves, an addition to reflect your generous help to me, and hit the final renders so I can get to composting the final image.
(It's werid how some stuff in the wireframe get colored and some doesn't. )
Wow, all these renders are beautiful.
I've already submitted my picture to the contest thread because this morning was the last chance I'd get to be at my computer before the contest deadline. Up to now, I've been using Daz mainly as a reference tool for sketches, so this scene, just by having multiple objects and lights in it, turned into one of the most complicated ones I've ever attempted.
The lights are what I always fight with. I love playing with them, but there's a lot that still bewilders me. The firelight glow I was going for seems to have worked on the background, but it leaves the foreground - mostly the fairy - darker than expected. I want it to look as though the room is lit only by the fire, but would have liked to see just a bit more detail lit up around the fairy. The fire (an orange point light) isn't the only light in the scene, but it is the strongest. Dialing up the intensity on other lights just seems to diminish the "glow" coming from the fireplace. Any suggestions? Even if I can't use it to tweak my submission for the contest, I'd love to get any kind of advice about lighting (or anything, really) in the scene.
This is the raw render with no post-work:
this is really a very cool picture