Iray GrungeWorx
Martial
Posts: 424
I have [Iray GrungeWorx] this product but after many times i cannot see nothing on the surface i try to put on
Yes i have parented the item to the surface i want to put on
Plaese if someone can detail the steps to put on a man chest or on a wall i will appreciate
Thanks
Post edited by Richard Haseltine on
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I don't have this one yet, but all decals work the same way. Parenting the decal is one part of it, but there are a couple other things to set up. The decal is a cube space, so the got the effect, the cube must intersect the surface where you want to project the image, optimally at a right angle. Then make sure the Z-Axis (the blue one) is pointing away from the surface. Preview and renders are Iray only.
Thanks for your suggestion
It woks now
I seem to be having issues with this also. Things I have discovered.
1. If I parent a 'wearable decal' to say the FACE, position/scale it as I want and hit Render, Daz crashes with an error, and any subsiquent render attempts report the device is in use. log out, login in to windows, to get back to being able to render again.
2. If I parent the decal to the face, position/scale as I want, then change the parent in place, and parent it to the root (node above hip - usually char name/container) it will render fine.
3. If I then change the pose of my character, and render, the dirt that was positioned to cover his face, doesn't move.
It appears that the work flow to get this purchased product to function in an animation say 90 frames.
a) parent decal to body part
b) adjust to desired liking,
c) unparent from body part, parent to root,
d) render frame 1
e) reparent decal to body part
f) adjust pose (you can't have an already tweened 90 frame animation setup as the decal will not be in the original place each time you change frames)
g) unparent and parent to root
h) render frame 2.
Now when I have 8 decals on various clothes assets and body parts, and tween animations won't work with this asset, to repeat this process for every frame for each decal is a huge waste of 600+ adjustments interspaced with 90 renders, and 90 manual reposes to achieve animation.
Am I doing something wrong, or is it just a limitiation of the product that is not advertised at time of purchase?
It is a limitation of Iray decals, not any fault of that specific product.
Eesh. Is there any other workaround? Like if I set the 'fit to: mode to the character, and Mode to redirect transforms, while it is parented to root, will it follow the specific body/pose changes? Kind of like eyelashes do? Doubtful as it has no bone joints to redirect transforms to,
Sounds like animations are a wipe and have to go with anime-style still/camera-based animations on oversized renders.
edit: I wonder if there was a way, Maybe I could create some sort of geoshell, with all the decals, in place on the specific body part, save it out, and just load it in each frame, and move them to root? if they were on a geoshell, that was on the body, would they display or render error out? It would cut the work in half. Though I've never worked with geo shells, so have no idea what I would be doing or where to start witht the concept?
edit 2: or I suppose, If I attached them to the corrosponding body part in the geo shell, made the animation tween, the geoshell would animate also, and decals would be in new positions each frame, then just change their parent each frame to the root of base model/character (parent in place). would that work?
Do decals even work on geoshells yet?
Decals use diffuse maps and opacity maps. Perhaps you could combine those image map with your character's skin maps in a photo editor, to create a new set of skin maps with the grunge on them. That should animate perfectly.
It would, but it would be awful hard to line up the dirt texture on the torso that shows through a hole in a shirt, exactly to match seamlessly with the dirt on the shirt it's self.
So that I understand this correctly. If I parent a decal to the head, and then pose/adjust, the decal should stay in the same location relative to the head regardless of how the head is moved, but it won't render. Am I correct in this line of understanding?
If so, then I can hopefully make the animation, and reparent to root in place and render the frame. I wonder if uses the current xyz transforms and rotations from just the current frame, the first frame, or specific to each frame, if it's the last, then I can just render the image series. If not, I need to duplicate them, change their parents to root, hide the originals (god I hope hiding doesn't generate an error.) and render. remove the duplicates, move to next frame, duplicate the originals, and repeat for each frame. Can I save out the decals as a wearable preset in case hiding generates an error? and just load them in each frame, change their parents and render?
edit: thing I find strange, is in the viewport, with iray select as draw style, the decal can be parented to non-root, you can pose and move stuff, the decal stays where it should relatively and iray draws it just fine. but errors on an actual render. I wonder what the implementation difference of drawing decals with iray in viewport vs an actually render is, and why one works and the other doesn't.
I haven't had a problem with it, but it's been a while since I have used Iray GrungeWorx | Daz 3D. Right Now, my system is busy working on a Motion Blur for Iray | Daz 3D scene
I tested it, and it doesn't work well in animation. You might have better with luck Layered Grunge Iray Shaders | Daz 3D. I use them a lot
Iray GrungeWorx | Daz 3D
Layered Grunge Iray Shaders | Daz 3D
Very short so pay attention
I'm running a test on this right now with Windows 10, DS 4.21.0.5 and G9 dev (no eyes, teeth, skin materials, etc.). I don't have Iray GrungeWorx, but all decals should behave the same way. I have Iray WetWorx so I tested that. I parented a decal to the G9 Head bone. I created an animation with him moving his head, bending his ear, opening his mouth, closing one eye, twirling around, etc. It seems to be rendering fine and the decal is following the movement pretty well. So, I don't know what is making it crash for you. If it works in Iray Preview but not final render, do you have a difference in Mesh Resolution for the final render that is higher than the Viewport resolution? Maybe you are simply running out of memory for the final render.
I do not think decals are good for animation, especially if you are trying to match a decal on a figure to the same decal on his clothes. When he moves, I don't know of any way to keep the the decals on the two different objects aligned, even if they are parented to corresponding bones on each object.
Here is an animation (121 frames) of decals on head and spine 4 on G9 and spine 4 on the shirt. Notice how the decals on the spines start aligned but move apart during the animation.
Video is 16 seconds ray GrungeWorx | Daz 3D.
Layered Grunge Iray Shaders | Daz 3D
Yeah it seems this product is only meant for single images. I can make the decals stay in place during pose transition, if they are parented to a deeper than root (upper abs say) but it will error on render, as they have to be on root for a render to suceed. Making a duplicate to preserve placement, and changing the duplicate to parent:root, will allow the render to succeed, but parent in place doesn't seem to function, so I have to reposition anyways.
Looking at the decal its self, under the projection heading, texture cooridinate system, it is set to object. Anyone have Ideas if I was to set that to world, change pose, change parent, if it would retain it's relative position, and if I would need to set it back to object.
Like seriously if I have a decal parented to "head" and I change parent "in place" it shouldn't drop down to waist level, and move completely X/Z off the subject. It should stay in place.
Do you have both a "wearable decal" and a standalone decal in that? I'm using the wearable one.
sorry I'm only using G8, but it shouldn't make a difference. It's not a mem issue. It's some sort of wierd texture type error (can't remember exactly) but it's like it's unable to locate something ( i suspect, locate where to actually place the texture of decal or something like that)
The latest, 4.21.05 ( ithink)
So far, if the decal is parented to HEAD, R-armBend, L-armBend, Uabbs, basically anything other than:
Genesis8
-hip
-clothes
-hair
-decal
-decal
-etc.
it errors on render. Changing poses with them on individual body parts. they appear to mostly stay put. changing poses where they will render, they don't follow the movement of anything I can figure out.
Leaving them parented to body parts, and changing poses, then unparent to root with stay inplace fails, and they never stay in place. could be the projection coordinate system that might be messing things up or if I changed it might have a setting to achieve what I want.
Daz it's self doesn't crash, it simple tries to start the render, and a tiny popup window with OK button says, error during render, and the new window image is checkboard with nothing.
Log file shows loading all the images/textures for all the assets, And I can only guess that as soon as it tries to do something with the decal system.. it spits out
2022-11-26 00:43:08.592 Iray [INFO] - IMAGE:IO :: 1.0 IMAGE io info : Loading image "G:\DAZ 2021\Applications\Data\DAZ 3D\My DAZ 3D Library\Runtime\Textures\DenkiGaka\Iray Super Shaders\BikinisGoneWild\ISS BGW 043.jpg", no selector, pixel type "Rgb", 4096x4096x1 pixels, 1 miplevel.
2022-11-26 00:43:08.594 Iray [INFO] - IMAGE:IO :: 1.0 IMAGE io info : Loading image "G:\DAZ 2021\Applications\Data\DAZ 3D\My DAZ 3D Library\Runtime\Textures\DenkiGaka\Iray Super Shaders\Height Maps\Silk.png", no selector, pixel type "Rgba", 1024x1024x1 pixels, 1 miplevel.
2022-11-26 00:43:10.366 [WARNING] :: ..\..\..\..\..\src\pluginsource\DzIrayRender\dzneuraymgr.cpp(369): Iray [WARNING] - API:DATABASE :: 1.0 API db warn : Transaction is released without being committed or aborted. Automatically aborting.
2022-11-26 00:45:00.265 [INFO] :: Total Rendering Time: 1 minutes 58.97 seconds
EDIT: forgot, once I get the error, If I try to render anything (stuff that would work ) it won't even try to error, it just reports "Unable to render. Renderer is already in use" I have to log off, log in windows, and reload everything.
It seems to work ok in the sense of I position a decal on the abs, duplicate, change parent in place to the shirt, make a minor adjustment if needed, and the dirt seems to span from shirt across rip/opening appearing on his chest, and then continues on the shirt on the other side . it just won't render unless I put the decal for his abs on root, and try to match it up.
Sad thing is, most of the work is still images comic book style, and I'm just trying to maintian continuity between images/scenes, though I do have some partial animations I would like to do if I didn't have to reposition 8 decals each frame manually.
So to make things as clear as possible.
I parent my decals to bones, and position:
Rendering above errors.
Changing pose works plausibly for scene continuity:
Render still fails.
I repose to scene and reparent all decals to root, either root of gen8 or root of clothes, Render succeeds.
If I was to animate or repose the character with all the decals on root (where renders suceed) the decals don't stay relative to their positions (all I did was 0 out all the rotations on root and hip, and raise it up a bit:
So I'm wondering if I start fresh, but If I change the decal projection system from object to either UVW or world, it might help
UPDATE:
a) When I encounter the error that causes subsequent render attempts to report the device is in use, it apparently is. Opening the log, closing, then opening again, shows at the end that iray is processing (render target written...) but there is no image, and no render window. Closing daz prompts to save (and I think doing so in this circumstance, corrupts the file). Daz will not open, and I have to restart to get back in.
b) I don't think this is totally a GW issue now, but rather either an iray or Daz issue that is occuring with as I mentioned, a corrupted save/scene because of c) below
c) I started fresh empty scene. loaded my character preset and all the junk. placed decals one at a time on Gen8 nodes (head, arm, uppAb) and successfully rendered each time I added one. I doubled up on the face, and still no problem. Clothes also had no problem with single or multiple decals. And to top it off, pose changes worked, and also changing the parent to root(in place) seemed to work, but going back most worked, while one did not (?)
So I have no idea now, I've tried so many variations, and have yet to try adding in the set again to test and see if it's some sort of wierd set with decals and causing compatability issues. I also have yet to save the above test, reload, and test render, to see if it's something with the way it saves them, or loads them.
This brings me to another side questions. If I save the decals, and the clothes, as a wearable preset, can they be loaded and function (maybe that's part of the problem) or even, decals that are attached to clothes in a wearable preset mess things up and I have to save those clothes independantly of the decals on Gen8 and each other?
Anyway. I don't think it's a product issue any more, but i do still welcome any further tips or info. I am also still interested in the impact of changing the decal projection system under coordinates.
Ok latest test results and I have pretty much found the root problem, though I don't know whom's responsible but I suspect DAZ.
Process:
A)Brand new empty scene - load character preset.
B) load all clothes, hair, anatomy preset wearables
C) create decals, position, etc. parent them to nodes, ie: L-forearm, R-forearm, head (x2), U abdomen, Lthigh+Rthigh on jeans, Uabdomen on shirt, head node on hair)
D) Renders before and after posing works.
E) saved all clothes with decals as seperate wearable preset. Saved all decals on Gen8 as wearable preset, saved all other items as wearable presets based on type (accessories, clothes etc.)
F) Saved scene, new scene, load scene I just saved. Load pose preset - Render fails.
G) restart windows, load daz, load scene, Test render with default scene pose - Render fails.
H) restart windows, load daz, load the character preset, each wearable preset, so basically it's the same scene I have been loading. Render succeeds. Pose change, Render succeeds.
Conclusion:
Something with the way Daz saves scenes or loads them, that contains decals that are parented to nodes of Gen8 and/or clothes assets that are parented to Gen8, are causing the renderer to bork.
I have no idea, if it's because the scenes are saved as 'compressed' and deselecting that might fix the issue
Update: Thought I would open a ticket about it. Decided to delete log file, reload scene, then render to get a concise log of it....
And of course.... it worked every way to Sunday, both with the default loaded pose, and the applied one. With the decals on clothes parented to root of clothes, and parented to nodes so that they maintain their position during posing. Worked every F'n time!
I dunno, I'm clueless now. Hours spent trying to figure out what not to do, and how to do stuff so it works, and not only do I not know what not to do because it generates and error or what to precisely do to avoid it, but I have accomplished nothing. Think I'm gonna give up now. Hope for the best, try a walking animation one or two more times, and if it errors, may have to switch to progressive stills rather than full animation...
I'm so exasperated now and almost don't feel like working on the project!
You should submit a help request with all the details. You may have found a new bug.
I would but I'm so fed up with the whole issue now. It's killed a day or more of time trying to figure it out and get a workflow that avoids the problem. I just can't be bothered to open a ticket, hunt through my posts here to copy/paste all the stuff (and edit for clarity and continuity), to have them ask me repeatedly "have you tried this?" or "what happens when you do this?". I know there is obviously something tripping to cause the error, but who knows maybe it's a tracer on my video card that is 0.003nM too thin.
Ok, so after figuring out a workflow that avoids the error. I managed to do some work. Today I opened a ticket for it as I'm fairly certain it's a daz issue, not a product issue, or my utilization of decals and my method saving/loading them. Here are the results I provided in the ticket, so any of you can avoid this until it's discovered what the cause is, and hopefully a fix.
I have encountered an error with the saving and loading of decals as wearable presets. I'm not sure if it's a bug with Daz (I suspect it is due to the effects), the product, or my lack of understand of decals and their limitations or how saving/loading them may or may not be possible.
I have been specifically working with this product: https://www.daz3d.com/iray-grungeworx
I have been able to narrow it down to reproducible (on my system at least) to the following:
a) Saving a scene which has 'wearable decals' parented to either root of Gen8M, specific bones (face/forearm, I assume all), or parented to clothing assets parented to Gen8M, and the decals are either parented to root, hip or any other sub bone of the clothing item generates the error when trying to render the scene after loading it.
b) I have tried creating wearable presets, of each clothing item, with the decals parented and in place, and a wearable preset of just the decals that are specifically positioned and parented on Gen8M. Creating a new file and loading them, or loading an old file, and loading the character preset, wearable presets, also generate the error.
c) If I load a scene which has no decals, or start a new scene, and load in my char preset with no decals or clothes, manually load clothes, decals, set materials, positions, parents of decals, both an individual render and render series with animation work fine.
d) Setting the viewport to draw as Iray, instead of Texture view, always works in all cases.
The errors or strange result behaviour during a) or b) above.
1. After hitting render for a single image or series, short duration as it tries to load the components as it doesn't even get to iterations or render target written , a new window/message opens reading "error during render" It immediately stops, in the case of a single image-new window, the image result window shows, it's all checkboard (transparent) and I can save/cancel.
2. If I try to hit render again, it reports that it can not start as the renderer is already in use.
2b. Checking the log file repeatedly (open, scroll to bottom, close, repeat) shows that iray is still running and performing iterations, though I don't believe I have ever seen a resulting image, mainly because I have already closed/cancelled the single image-new window without saving.
3. Closing Daz after getting this error, results in Daz not loading. It doesn't even appear in the task manager. The little windows busy mouse cursor appears briefly, then returns to the normal cursor. The only way to be able to utilize daz again is to restart windows. (I'm fairly confident I tried log off/on first (more than once) and daz would still not load. Restarting worked every time.
Now I'm not sure if it's a limitation of the decal system (though i suspect iray issue and daz not loading wouldn't occur in that case) or if i'm saving them improperly, or if there is a product specific issue, or if some information is not getting saved properly. But it makes the decal continuity between scenes almost impossible.
Basically I have to create the char and position decals from scratch, load in say a house, pose, camera, render series. Delete everything but the char/assets with decals, delete all key frames, load say a street set/asset and pose, position animate everything and render with out ever closing the scene, closing daz, or turning of my computer. I'll be hozed if there is a power outage or a windows hard crash before I finish.
And so we have it. while working I had to change the rotations+translations of some of the decals for a specific camera angle. Tried to render a single frame to check appearance......."Error during rendering!"
Didn't reload nothing, same file, same scene that's been open a week. 24+ hours of an animation render I did last night, and it's all wasted!. And do you think DAZ could even acknowlegde the ticket I created? Like not even a "we are investigating" or hopefully " We have replicated the issue and are investigating". No of course not. Just utter silence. Take my money, and shut the hell up when there is a problem.
If they want to see more $$$ from me they need to get their act together and act like responsible vendors! AND solve this FKn problem!
... I wouldn't be surprised if their PR deletes this right quick, as they wouldn't want negative PR about their failings, and lack of communication in resolving problems with their stuff.
Like seriously DAZ! Fill in the blank: "DAZ 3D's estimated annual revenue is currently $27.1M per year but we can't update or acknowledge a ticket in 5 days because _________________ ."
How does one get Grungeworx -- or any decal -- applied full-body NOT to get on the eyeballs?